Sensei Richard Amos

[shotokan101]

Jim,

Going back to Amos Sensei, the point was to NOT relate his Gohon Kumite with distance preparation applied to Jyu Kumite. Through the comments regarding the Gohon Kumite, the topic drifted, and the point was becoming moot.

We could physically, face-to-face compare Gohon Kumite or Jyu Kumite, to relay the differences. I wasn't implying any brutality would be enforced.

KF

Thanks for clarifying that Kyle - I obviously read more into it than intended - topic drift or not I'd still be interested on some feedback on the last points made regarding Gohn training and preparation - I'm sure we won't get shut down as being too far off-topic.....

JIm

[dodwatt]

Kyle

I am sorry but I don't think you have done yourself any favours here, this is the second time now you have sent challenges out – first to Steve and now a group of us who have disagreed with you.

Please get something clear, there are many who post here who really have experience and often outside of karate (door work etc) so DO NOT get any idea we would be scared of 'brutality' from you.

So either debate sensibly or cut out the silly challenges, as you may get a shock if certain people did turn up and that is not a counter challenge just reality.

You have basically studied your karate within your organisation, and there is a lot more to see and learn from.

So please, debate and accept it is allowed to disagree with you, because if it is not, then this site is doomed and may well be because of the termination of the account of one of it's biggest supporters because he chose to, shall we say 'not bow to your name' but instead comment from his knowledge base and experience.

Kyle you may well not be making yourself clear but it seems several have disagreed with you.

[kensei]

George,

I think I have figured out three things from reading this speicifc thread....
1) Kyle is new to the Forum and comes from a very famous family...and is a target because of it. If he suggested that his lecture on Mae Geri being a great Kick for kumite....everyone would jump on him saying they prefer Mawashi and he is over stepping his bounds...and then a challenge will be percieved when he asks others to come out and train and see what he has to say!
2)Kyle has a learning curve to deal with. He has been training as long as I have, or less, but he has focused on traditional/Sport Karate..and I have focused on fighting skills that will keep my short ass alive in a fight. I doubt he can say he has been shot at...stabbed three times, Tazered, Pepper Sprayed and had his head kicked with work boots...but then again he has nicer hair than I have as well...and I would still go and train with him and exchange ideas. We have not seen that his Ego says "he knows best" because he has a higher rank, comes from a "Karate family" or has a fancy Dojo. In fact we have seen that he just wants to chat.
3) we know that you are firmly in the same camp as Steve....in fact I actually figured you for Steve at one point! It is abundantly apparent that you have a similar chip/axe to grind. I would greatly appreciate it if you would SPEAK to others on an equal playing feild.

Unless you really want to spend the money (you meaning anyone) to travel probably half way around the world for a silly Dojo fight then any challenge should be seen as some moron trying to look macho in the stupidest way! I think we all know this, I dont think Kyle was trying to challenge someone and probably realizes that he is talking to many different people from all over the world and some of us do not travel to simply throw down with someone to prove we are more manly than the next...its bunk and makes the other person look the fool!

Now that this is out of the way....I hope to one day train with Sensei Amos, from all accounts he is a fantastic instructor!

[dodwatt]

No prob, guys. Debates can be debated, debated, debated...debated...and debated....and debated...and debated, so that's all I have to say. If you're ever in the Northern California area, stop by and then we can compare experiences through action.

KF

If this is not challenging statement, I don't know, that is not debating, and only because we did not agree with the distancing issue on the DVD clip of gohon kumite.

I'm sorry James but you are normally the first one to disagree if you don't think something is right, and in this point we said that distancing in gohon kumite should be trained from day one, which he disagreed with, and that was his responce above, a bit childish don't you think.

[kylefunakoshi]

Kyle

I am sorry but I don't think you have done yourself any favours here, this is the second time now you have sent challenges out – first to Steve and now a group of us who have disagreed with you.

Please get something clear, there are many who post here who really have experience and often outside of karate (door work etc) so DO NOT get any idea we would be scared of 'brutality' from you.

So either debate sensibly or cut out the silly challenges, as you may get a shock if certain people did turn up and that is not a counter challenge just reality.

You have basically studied your karate within your organisation, and there is a lot more to see and learn from.

So please, debate and accept it is allowed to disagree with you, because if it is not, then this site is doomed and may well be because of the termination of the account of one of it's biggest supporters because he chose to, shall we say 'not bow to your name' but instead comment from his knowledge base and experience.

Kyle you may well not be making yourself clear but it seems several have disagreed with you.

Mr Watt,

You are misunderstanding me, as usual. We can exchange ideas and concepts and get our points understood without being physically abused. Everyone understands concepts in various ways.

I have studied within and outside my organization (and other martial arts), so I think you made that assumption yourself.

I don't expect anyone to bow to me. I just came to throw my 2 cents in without being attacked from a million different angles. If you want to debate on an equal and rational basis online, then fine. If you want to train in person, then fine. Only difference is I do it with class.

KF

[james luke]

I for one have had enough of these juvenile pissing contests, from experience I know both Doddwatt and fujicolt to be gentlemen of the first water and instructors of integrity and proffesionalism. Can i suggest to all sides that if you cannot indulge in reasoned and cogent debate then remain silent rather than resorting to vain and egotistical posturing it certainly is not "classy".

[kylefunakoshi]

[kylefunakoshi]

I for one have had enough of these juvenile pissing contests, from experience I know both Doddwatt and fujicolt to be gentlemen of the first water and instructors of integrity and proffesionalism. Can i suggest to all sides that if you cannot indulge in reasoned and cogent debate then remain silent rather than resorting to vain and egotistical posturing it certainly is not "classy".

Shihan Luke,

I'm reciprocating the treatment I receive. If your friends are gentlemen, then I'll be so. If not, I'll make my point, and not be silent as a result.

KF

[james luke]

I joined this forum as a vehicle for learning and research and have had many interesting and informed debates. Recently it has degenerated into argumentative comparisons of various instructors videos/views. In a final riposte, I have barely known fujicolt for personally for three weeks and met the man once. I have yet to meet doddwatt but have conversed with him quite a bit, I would not be so presumptuous as to call them friends however I hope that will change in the future. They have both extended the hand of friendship and are willing to train and teach with anyone, would that the rest of the martial arts community were as free of vanity and ego.
To all contributors to this forum, be well and good fortune on your various paths.

[kylefunakoshi]

James,

Likewise.

[kensei]

The last I will have to say on this issue...becuase we are about as far away from chatting about Richard Amos as possible at this point...is that I find it interesting when one person has a comment about coming out to train we all think it a bully move, but when others do it they are simply trying to engage in sharing ideas...but the verbage is pretty much the same.

May I suggest two things to end this moronic debate and pissing contest....First is that we take all invitations as being a challenge to learn and not to fight! I think we can tell when one person is saying "COme to my Dojo and I will kick your tail till you cant walk" and "Come out and we can exchange ideas and hash this out"! Seriously people!
Second lets agree that it is fine to agree to disagree over specific things and it often takes a while for an open mind to catch things and learn from them. With Steve I often found myself pissed off at him, felt like he was being...well a dick! Then I would go away, go to the Dojo and work on something and figure out he was looking at it from ad different angle and not really wrong...which almost annoyed me even more Fact of the matter is that many who visit here and chat have great experiences and can contribute, in many ways.

Lets stop the pissing contest...truth be told if you show up at my Dojo to challenge me...my place of work and my business...you might find yourself in Jail for trying to assault me and my students or you might end up walking backwards slowly with my gun in your face (If I was american). Or in my case a hockey stick upside the head! Any moron that challenges another instructor to a fight over the net should be booted from the forum and watched by the local authorities..they are mentally unballenced....Now....Back to Mr Amos...a fine instructor I am told!

[kylefunakoshi]

The last I will have to say on this issue...becuase we are about as far away from chatting about Richard Amos as possible at this point...is that I find it interesting when one person has a comment about coming out to train we all think it a bully move, but when others do it they are simply trying to engage in sharing ideas...but the verbage is pretty much the same.

May I suggest two things to end this moronic debate and pissing contest....First is that we take all invitations as being a challenge to learn and not to fight! I think we can tell when one person is saying "COme to my Dojo and I will kick your tail till you cant walk" and "Come out and we can exchange ideas and hash this out"! Seriously people!
Second lets agree that it is fine to agree to disagree over specific things and it often takes a while for an open mind to catch things and learn from them. With Steve I often found myself pissed off at him, felt like he was being...well a dick! Then I would go away, go to the Dojo and work on something and figure out he was looking at it from ad different angle and not really wrong...which almost annoyed me even more Fact of the matter is that many who visit here and chat have great experiences and can contribute, in many ways.

Lets stop the pissing contest...truth be told if you show up at my Dojo to challenge me...my place of work and my business...you might find yourself in Jail for trying to assault me and my students or you might end up walking backwards slowly with my gun in your face (If I was american). Or in my case a hockey stick upside the head! Any moron that challenges another instructor to a fight over the net should be booted from the forum and watched by the local authorities..they are mentally unballenced....Now....Back to Mr Amos...a fine instructor I am told!

James,

Couldn't have been better said. Thank God for rational people.

KF

[nathanso]

No prob, guys. Debates can be debated, debated, debated...debated...and debated....and debated...and debated, so that's all I have to say. If you're ever in the Northern California area, stop by and then we can compare experiences through action.

KF

If this is not challenging statement, I don't know, that is not debating, and only because we did not agree with the distancing issue on the DVD clip of gohon kumite.

I am surprised that anyone would take this as a challenge for a physical confrontation. I thought that this clearly was a statement that it would be easier to compare what people were trying to get across in person instead of just by text- something that is frequently said on this and other forums.

[shotokan101]

Well Neil/"All" - as I was the one to originally misinterpret Kyle's remark I suppose I should say something......

TBH it was the context of the original comment given that it was thrown into the dialogue after an apparent "withdrawal" from willingness to debate the point under discussion/dispute further - when TBH it wasn't exactly a very subtle technical point about Karate technique or thraining methodology that was being discussed - just simple targetting and distance for Sanbon/Gohon Kumiter drills.

Not stirring this up here but just explaining what it was about Kyle's post that "pushed my buttons" and led to my initial remark which has triggered this somewhat animated discussion.

Jim

[kanku]

To be honest I was not offended by Kyle's post and did not see that as a challenge but I found his withdrawal from the topic a bit disappointing ,since we are all here to discuss and debate about various aspects of karate .


I would have liked to see Kyle and others to debate this subject about kumite and gohon kumite a bit more , I for one am never afraid to be proven wrong . I look at it as you are doing me a favor if I learn something new and see it your way or from a different angle , so if you feel like it lets go back to the subject and learn from each others experiences ...!