are basics complicated when it comes to Kumite?

[fujicolt]

I recently had a great experience by spending time with Karateka showing me how the JKA are developing things. it was brilliant and showed how simple basics become complicated and then simple again ONCE you really understand.

Have you experienced this? I am not claiming the developments are perfect - i had my questions!

But - very thought provoking!

[RenegadeMonk]

I have come full circle in my study of kihon as it relates to kata application; which is not to say the journey is complete, I think I feel the cycle beginning again even now. Since I don't believe in kata applications that aren't useable in free kumite I suppose this feeling extends to kihon in kumite as well.

Steve, could you expand on the kind of developments the JKA are making?

[fujicolt]

Ha - three days with these guys so it would take pages to describe. Excellent stuff on fluidity of movement, stance development made easier, correct muscle development to aid speed and stability and excellent stuff to increase had speed and diminish any lag in your technique.

[RenegadeMonk]

What level karateka are such refinements intended for?

[fujicolt]

ALL - and when i see some things I think many could gain from it. It is pure shotokan but clearly not what many 'think' Shotokan is

[kanku]

ALL - and when i see some things I think many could gain from it. It is pure shotokan but clearly not what many 'think' Shotokan is

can you elaborate a bit more please ? for example how different they move in front stance to deliver a sharper and faster oie zuki ?

[fujicolt]

by totally understanding the structure and mechanics of the correct stance (not the distortion of it we oft see) - what muscles are actually used to move it, how to place the feet correctly, how to develop the body to maximize performance, how to get rid of unnecessary movement or effort that dissipates best usage and HOW to practice for all this. AND It is not at all about being Japanese!and i have film of it all that smashes that myth to bits.

put sorry - before you ask - I cannot post the film cos it was a private filming made in Japan with copyright etc.

It is also about understanding that once the above is grasped it can then go to an even higher level that may (at first) seem to contradict the initial learning. But that concept is not unique to Karate (try flying aeroplanes for example - learn to do it well and then do an aerobatics course

IMHO Far too many are sticking to old ways and not moving shotokan forward as i have oft voiced - but there is much out there now AND accessible. you either search it out and gain or stick with 'Well we have always done it this way' and carry on as you are.

Sorry if that upsets anyone - tis just my opinion. but i am still searching and finding the search VERY enlightening and productive - which is nice!

[kanku]

by totally understanding the structure and mechanics of the correct stance (not the distortion of it we oft see) - what muscles are actually used to move it, how to place the feet correctly, how to develop the body to maximize performance, how to get rid of unnecessary movement or effort that dissipates best usage and HOW to practice for all this. AND It is not at all about being Japanese!and i have film of it all that smashes that myth to bits.

sorry but you have not said much by generalizing it with your above statement , I have been told this for years and I am sure many other students have ,how to get from A to B and what goes on in between ,nothing new in there unless you have something new to add .

[fujicolt]

LOL - as i said Kanku many think they know (and some indeed do) but many quite simply and sadly do not . I did answer your question and to be fair I am not (surely) gonna be expected to spend hours writing descriptions for you - go explore you'll find it.

BUT If you think i generalised = simple: you particularise, in the manner you ask me to, about what you know (so then i will know what you expect of me and i'll then tell you if this stuff is different than what you do. Is that not fair and reasonable

[kanku]

LOL - as i said Kanku many think they know (and some indeed do) but many quite simply and sadly do not . I did answer your question and to be fair I am not (surely) gonna be expected to spend hours writing descriptions for you - go explore you'll find it.

BUT If you think i generalised = simple: you particularise, in the manner you ask me to, about what you know (so then i will know what you expect of me and i'll then tell you if this stuff is different than what you do. Is that not fair and reasonable

LOL indeed !! you come up with this thread then I ask you a particular question and you answer with something like" by doing it properly ,how to place their foot correctly ! "

as if to say all along we have all been doing it wrongly and were never taught how to efficiently move .

I really don't see the point of this thread ...

[fujicolt]

Kanku

painful as it may sound many have not been taught how to move correctly and surely, if you have been around long enough you will have witnessed it.

i am far from being the only one with that opinion - we so often see exaggerated stances with incorrect structure and foot positioning and incorrect mechanics etc when moving. Come on Kanku be fair and what happened to your motto 'never give up!' - i had adviced members that I had a very pleasent and enlightening with persons directly connected to very recent and current training developments at Takudai and then was merely discussing the points and suggested a way to discuss it with you - please don't throw your toys out of the pram Kanku it's just discussion LOL

[RenegadeMonk]

Lol. Or some peoples version of a discussion.

Steve, where should we look to find these new developments?

[kanku]

[quote="RenegadeMonk"]Lol. Or some peoples version of a discussion.

quote]

Exactly ...

Steve I stand by my motto but by saying go explore or just give a general reply as say by doing it correctly we can't really have a discussion .

[fujicolt]

BUT If you think i generalised = simple: you particularise, in the manner you ask me to, about what you know (so then i will know what you expect of me and i'll then tell you if this stuff is different than what you do. Is that not fair and reasonable

did this not invite discussion or did you both speed read over that? Or have we got two of you who trained for a little bit in the past and are now reminiscing and maybe cannot remember what you used to do

[RenegadeMonk]

LOL

Steve, where do you suggest we look for these new JKA advancements? Who did you train with etc?