shotokan vs others??

[shotojs78]

Hi, if you were shotokan... black belt.. sandan or yondan etc.. and you would learn a new kata from another style.. shito-ryu, goju ryu, wado-ryu, matsubayashi-ryu, uechi-ryu.. which would you choose, what style and what kata??

thanks

sorry for my english!!

[kensei]

If you "need" to study another style then maybe you should just study that style! Now if you want to learn another styles Kata then pick Sanchin and study them all

[Paul Bedard]

I agree with James, if you need another style then go there. As a sandan or yondan we still have so many of our own kata to explore. Shotokan has a piece of all the others in it, just focus on what you want at the time. For example hangetsu is our goju kata. Having said this, if I was to learn from the others, I would look at sanchin like Kensei & maybe something with shiko dachi.. However, I`m not sure that I`ll have time for that because as I focus on new shotokan kata I`m not training some of the ones that I know enough, so I have to revisit them & then tackle the next new one. I`ll be older & greyer before I consider that I have explored all the shotokan kata adequately.. I have only been in shotokan for 25 yrs, so much more to learn.
Osu
Paul B

[kensei]

the obsession with knowing everything is strange to me. First off I "get" why others look outside their art for answers not given by their instructors...for that I always say look to other instructors!

I respect and think that people like Asai Sensei were worlds beyond most of us in knowledge, but I dont get making up 100 new Kata all "Shotokan" in appearance when most students and instructors can not remember all 26 of the original Katas! I for one can Dance through all of them save two but I really focus on four or five to make myself better and learn about the deeper meanings.

For me to say, "hell I want to learn more outside of Shotokan" would be silly, I still have so far to go and 99.9% of those that I have seen that have gone outside of their own style should NOT have...I see way to many weak points in some instructors performance for them to simply play off the training and move over to another style for answers. I understand if it is out of frustration that their instructor is not building a solid knowledge base with them....but that is a single instructor...not a style.

In other words, their is far to much to learn and train in Shotokan for me to jump ship...even if for a breif looksy!

[Fish Of Doom]

FWIW, here is Mabuni's opinion on kata training:

http://seinenkai.com/articles/tankosich/tankosich3.html

To make it short, Mabuni essentially says to learn all the kata you want, but to always have specific kata you focus your training on, having the rest as a matter of having extra material to look into when you need or want to.

[shotojs78]

ok, forget that, you dont understand my question.... it was, if you wanted practice others katas from another style.. which one.. that's it.. you dont need to explain me why I dont need to do that, you dont know me..

thanks...

[kensei]

ok, forget that, you dont understand my question.... it was, if you wanted practice others katas from another style.. which one.. that's it.. you dont need to explain me why I dont need to do that, you dont know me..

thanks...

We know we dont know you....but your question is which style would "WE" travel to in order to pick up Kata....answer.....NONE! Shotokan has enough to learn in it by itself. Nuff said

[shotojs78]

I know we have enough kata.... just 10 could be enough, maybe 3.. do not think about 26 or 20 that is enough, just if you ''have'' to choose another kata from another style, which one.. so ok.. maybe it would be sanchin... great

[kounelaki]

Eh, I like expanding my horizons. I've not even reached shodan level yet, but I can't see myself being content with just the 26 kata in Shotokan when I'm a sandan or yondan.

I guess it's a good idea to "study" some kata closely, but I don't see any harm in learning new kata, just so you don't get bored. Once you get to a certain level it's very easy to learn a new kata very quickly - there's only a limited number of moves in shotokan katas and sequences tend to repeat themselves.

Anyway, I'd like to learn a few of the Goju Ryu kata because a friend of mine does that style. I think we're going to swap a few kata soon.

[kensei]

I know we have enough kata.... just 10 could be enough, maybe 3.. do not think about 26 or 20 that is enough, just if you ''have'' to choose another kata from another style, which one.. so ok.. maybe it would be sanchin... great

Okay, if push came to shove I would study Sanchin...but not just "Sanchin" I would learn the Goju and Uechi versions of the Kata. Two different versions...one Kata!

Eh, I like expanding my horizons. I've not even reached shodan level yet, but I can't see myself being content with just the 26 kata in Shotokan when I'm a sandan or yondan.

I guess it's a good idea to "study" some kata closely, but I don't see any harm in learning new kata, just so you don't get bored. Once you get to a certain level it's very easy to learn a new kata very quickly - there's only a limited number of moves in shotokan katas and sequences tend to repeat themselves.

Anyway, I'd like to learn a few of the Goju Ryu kata because a friend of mine does that style. I think we're going to swap a few kata soon.

When I was a Kyu level I thought the same way, went to study Isshin ryu with a buddy and Goju...then realized how MUCH their was in our Kata to learn and perfect and I could live a life time and not really complete all of it. Dont worry, around Shodan you start to realize how little you know...or you dont and you drop Karate!

[karaterowe]

I've shrunk my kata collection... I don't bother with Jiin or Wankan anymore. I've heard that the JKA took them off the list, too.

I don't think it hurts to learn kata from other styles, but I don't find it neccessary either. If there is some technique or fighting application lacking in Shotokan, and found somewhere else, why not just learn that specific technique and keep it in your back pocket?

[Dave Gallagher]

Stick with Shotokan kata. Don't lower your standards. (just kidding).

[humanpunchingbag]

I know we have enough kata.... just 10 could be enough, maybe 3.. do not think about 26 or 20 that is enough, just if you ''have'' to choose another kata from another style, which one.. so ok.. maybe it would be sanchin... great

Just coming in for a moment. I personally have picked Sanchin as the one kata outside of Shotokan that I work on. Otherwise, I actually have paired down my Shotokan kata to the Heians, Tekki Shodan, the Big Four, Gankaku, Sochin, once in a blue moon Hangetsu and Niju Shiho. Just looking at that list I want to edit some more. (don't get me wrong: I can bumble my way through all the 26 with exception of Ji'in. And I do a really bad job of Wankan).

Funny thing is, that since I started learning Sanchin, I have found that my Shotokan kata feel sharper, more surgical, more exact. Maybe its just because I finally get to loosen up and snap out some speed. BTW: there are many versions of Sanchin and I only intend to learn the one I know now.

[RenegadeMonk]

I think this is quite a good question, if I bother to think about it rather than just lecture the asker.

It makes me ask myself what I want and what I feel I can get from a kata.

I would probably go for Uechi Seisan.

[bassaiguy]

I've always been interested in some of the basic xing-i forms. They are very linear like Sanchin, but include a variety of attacks. To me they seem a lot like patterned kihon and lord knows I can use the practice. That said, I don't practice any kata outside the Shotokan syllabus, although I do know the Moo Duk Kwan variations of several forms as that was my first style in the 80's.